ATF EM belt review

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DER SOLDATEN
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ATF EM belt review

Post by DER SOLDATEN »

I found the belt to thin. It was not bad looking, but not identical as stated in the add.The biggest problem was the the inside of the tongue.It was made of some sort of shredded leather that was already starting to come apart before the belt was ever in use.In my opinion it is not worth the money.But judge for you sell here are some picture of the ATF belt next to an original dated 1943.The darker belt is the original.
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The belt was thinner and not as heavy as the original.Yes I know that there were different makers.But the problem I had was the inside tongue.It was just to thin and as I said was already coming apart,I have yet to see shredded leather like this on any German leather item.The ATF belt is repro dated 1942.I would like to learn more about belts if anyone has any more info the would care to share.
Obergefreiter Michael Frye
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by Halle »

Just looks like a really bad quality product - by the end of the war German leather quality had deteriorated appreciably , often being replaced by pressed cardboard , and belts became thinner likewise - but it doesn't mean you have to put up with a poor product . :evil:
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by S.Wilhelm »

Last month I bought an A frame from ATF and the quality of the leather was really bad, looks like the same you show, I prefer the old one I own from Zeugmasterei.
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by SchutzeHagemann »

I'm not a fan of the current ATF leather stuff either. And I hate the lines that follow the sides of the leather. I personally love Vit Zemanek's belts and leather gear. Also, J.H. Berger is making Mantel straps so I'm sure those are great as well. However, ATF's tropical stuff is top notch.
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by DER SOLDATEN »

SchutzeHagemann wrote:I'm not a fan of the current ATF leather stuff either. And I hate the lines that follow the sides of the leather. I personally love Vit Zemanek's belts and leather gear. Also, J.H. Berger is making Mantel straps so I'm sure those are great as well. However, ATF's tropical stuff is top notch.
Could you be so kind as to send me a link to where I can purchase a good combat belt. I would like some one to make one custom of a template I have of the original one shown in the photos.
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by DER SOLDATEN »

Email I recievied today from ATF about the belt.

Show Details FROM:At the Front TO:panzerjager228@yahoo.com Message flagged Thursday, June 28, 2012 2:09 PM
Hello,
I have the belt it came in today.
Looked it over and do not see it as being defective.
I gave it to Rollin and thus he posted a whole page of information on the German belt page.
I'll refund your order on this order number and then mail you the $4.00 return ship cost you paid through the mail as the cart will not let me refund more than the sale was originally charged.
Here is a copy of the belt page with photos and a very good description.


About German Leather Belts


Our belts are made just like the originals. Period. Many people are get rather confused as to how they are sized, don't understand that they adjust, how the buckle attaches or how they are made.

WWII belts are made from cow or horse hide, and are 45mm wide. The marked size is the length of the belt, end to end, in centimeters, and they have about 5 inches of adjustment. They vary some in detail from maker to maker- the number and length of stitches, whether or not the edges are creased, and the number and size of the holes in the tongue. Most tongues have 7 sets of holes, but I have encountered 8 sets as well. Of the several originals we have on hand- the thickness of the belt itself ranges from 3.8mm-4.3mm and the tongues from 1.4mm-2mm. This is typical for all German leather gear and leather in general.

EM belts are usually made rough side out- the smooth side of the leather faces inward. This reduces friction on your body. The rough side often appears smooth but that is due to how it was finished, polishing, as well as age and wear which can gradually smooth the surface. Thus, some originals have a smoother outer surface than others.

The tongue (except on M44 belts which doesn't have it) is only to hold the buckle in place. It is much thinner than the main belt because it carries much less stress- the prongs on the buckle dig into the backside of the belt, putting most of the pressure there. If we made the tongue as thick as the belt itself, it would be too thick to slide between the face of the buckle and the shaft that holds the prongs.

Below are photos of three belts:
Original: This is the particular belt we copied. It is unissued, RB numbered, size 95. Notice the sloppy stitches- we know these would be rejected as defective so we didn't quite copy it exactly.
ATF 2012: One of our newer belts, that a customer insists isn't like an original, and is far too thin and "will fail in the field".
Made by Rollin 1989: This I made in my Mom's basement in '88 or '89- prior to ATF. It is the same design as the other two belts, and slightly thinner. It has survived 125+ events. I am not easy on my equipment, and I often go without Y-straps which puts even more stress on the belt. I have trashed alot of gear, but not the belt: I ripped a folding shovel carrier in half (fell on the ice at the Gap in '93), broke several canteen straps, broke a belt buckle (original) and have worn the soles off my jackboots 3 times in the same period. It looks rough, but it's still going 23+ years later. It has never failed and it has never been repaired.

Note: Notice what oil and dirt do to the color- it started out lighter than the ATF belt.

If you are really worried than the Germans and I are wrong, and you can't shake the feeling that the belt will break and all your gear will spill, get an M44 belt.


The was a picture included but I could not copy and paste it here.
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by Mikkel »

Perhaps they know squat about hides, and which hide to chose for what product.

But then again, when they only had Sturm tunics, they tried to talk their way out of it, by stating that they were just about identical to originals...
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by S.Wilhelm »

Go for Vit Zemanek, http://www.continentalmilitaria.com/

The leather quality is one of the best round ;)
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by m1steelpot »

The leather on the tongue is fine. If the roughness doesn't appeal to you, shave it down.

I've been using a Grigsby Militaria belt for 5 years, the "tongue" is very thin and has not failed once.
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by GraemeMac »

I have original canteen straps aswell as utility straps/random bits of leather on gear(breadbags, etc) which are every bit as rough as that, or worse.

A hide has two sides, smooth side, and rough. The rough side can be smoothed down by wear, shaving, and oil/grime and more wear. I've had no issues what so ever with ATF leather gear.
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by Pz Gren Hoffmann »

I have a lot of ATF leather gear (including one of these belts, and their texled a-frame) and all of it is top notch, great quality leather.
The tongue on my belt is also wery thin, but it's still wery sturdy.
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by DER SOLDATEN »

[quote="GraemeMac"]I have original canteen straps aswell as utility straps/random bits of leather on gear(breadbags, etc) which are every bit as rough as that, or worse.

I would love to see those.I'm very interested in different wartime Items. Do you have any pictures to share of you originals with this type of leather?
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by DER SOLDATEN »

Pz Gren Hoffmann wrote:I have a lot of ATF leather gear (including one of these belts, and their texled a-frame) and all of it is top notch, great quality leather.
The tongue on my belt is also wery thin, but it's still wery sturdy.

Maybe it was good. I had some gear from china that had the same look and it feel apart in a month. I did not want to take the same chance on this. In hand it look like some type of leather mulch instead of a solid piece.
As far a shaving it. There would not have been nothing left at the end.As stated is was coming apart in my hand.
I have a few more picture on my phone I will share later.
Also I was wanting something that reflected German leather in 1942 not 45 I would have gotten the late war belt if that were the case.
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by J.Klinsmann »

S.Wilhelm wrote:Go for Vit Zemanek, http://www.continentalmilitaria.com/

The leather quality is one of the best round ;)

Hi Wilhelm

how thick is the belt, im interested


Kind Regards

Nick
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Re: ATF EM belt review

Post by DER SOLDATEN »

J.Klinsmann wrote:
S.Wilhelm wrote:Go for Vit Zemanek, http://www.continentalmilitaria.com/

The leather quality is one of the best round ;)

Hi Wilhelm

how thick is the belt, im interested


Kind Regards

Nick
I ordered one so as soon as I get it will post photos of it with measurements.
Obergefreiter Michael Frye
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