Cosby Victory Show 2012

[PanzerMart]

You're right Mart, it would be lovely to get it completely realistic, but it won't happen for many reasons. To be fair, I couldn't see your PAK unless I popped my head up, which I only did to check the pyro was clear before I detonated it. There were very few casualties behind me. If that situation were real, the allied armour would have stayed at distance, shelling the trenches and german armour, whilst the infantry moved forward and took care of the german armour for them, not the other way around.

With regard to US casualties, as Stig says, they were there aplenty. Some may well have come back to life once the action moves on, because the crowd aren't watching them, but they were there.

Too many people come into these pieces of theatre with their tactical heads on. It's why it sometimes takes the British infantry an eon to get down the field. They take it all a bit too literally. At the end of the day, it is drama, and it needs to follow a script. Seems that either the script gets forgotten or the group leaders at the briefings are not passing the script on. We may have to look at just how this is done next year, and maybe have a dress rehearsal without blank and bangs on the friday evening, as it is a three day show in 2013.

I like the rehearsal idea and as you say its a 3 day show next year (yay) it might help iron out any problems

I dont think its the leaders passing on the breifing more a case of were here were doing this thing or going that way, it seems to lack more cohersion than anything.

[Halle]

Perhaps the Germans could attack - we can still lose , getting beaten back with fearfull losses ?

[rsvpiper]

How about a mid morning axis advance(win ) followed by the inevitable during the big battle

[PanzerMart]

Perhaps the Germans could attack - we can still lose , getting beaten back with fearfull losses ?

Am no running all the way down that field especially if the weathers the same

[Halle]

You don't have to , just get dropped off by a half track

[PanzerMart]

You don't have to , just get dropped off by a half track

those poor brit lads that attacked our pak gun were completely knackered by the time they got to us (thinks thats why they had so many more casualties that side ) and they were dropped off in a half track! ........ anyways I do FJ bloody panzer grens will pinch all the halftrack space

[Johnny_BoomBoom2000]

You're stuck in some fantasy here. It's a show. It runs to a script. It's not tactical. It's put on for the public. Not every vehicle owner wants their expensive tin can messing up with pyro. Those that did, came forward, including Jim who owns one of the most expensive bits on the field. Can I point out that a) it's not real and b) if it were, the amount of HE that went off around the trenches would have liquidised most of the defenders insides and severely traumatised those not killed? I don't think I saw one German killed by the shell fire. By the time the infantry came to mop up, there would have been few people capable of ruining their day with an MG42. If you aren't satisfied with it, and don't feel it's orfentik enough for you, please let Dave Pratt know that you and your group don't wish to be embarrassed by being a part of it next year. There are people queuing up to be in this display. A lot of work goes into that "battle", the pyro crew alone put in well over 150 man hours to accomplish two 20/25 minute scenarios. It boils my piss when people start to take it apart, like they could do it any fecking better

BaggyPants - apologies if my comments were the ones that caused your piss to boil!!! Certainly not my intention - the organisation and running of the show is beyond my ken! My 'constructive criticisms' were not intended to piss anyone off! In fairness I realise this is a show, I realise a lot of rare, expensive and irreplaceable equipment is on show and not everyone wants pyros near that equipment!!

Apologies if I boiled your piss with my comments - I appreciate the efforts put in by the pyro teams and everyone organising the show, and look forward to participating next year (if I'm invited back....) - 'cos I had a great time this year!!!

[carvillan]

I was in the crowd and the pyro was excellent. No-one is having a go at the battle at all. Far from it, they have all commented on the quality of the battle. I think all the guys are saying is that some of the allies need to do their best to make the re-enactment more a re-enactment of what actually went on.

For instance, I heard a comment from a member of the Sturmpanzer (who is an ex British Army tanker) about how they have all of their hatches closed to be realistic where as you can quite clearly see that the allies have driver and radio man/machine gunner with heads out of the tank. No way is that realistic.

[rsvpiper]

Perhaps the Germans could attack - we can still lose , getting beaten back with fearfull losses ?

Am no running all the way down that field especially if the weathers the same

Recon all the FJ's would jump in now that would be a show starter

[Johnny_BoomBoom2000]

You don't have to , just get dropped off by a half track

those poor brit lads that attacked our pak gun were completely knackered by the time they got to us (thinks thats why they had so many more casualties that side ) and they were dropped off in a half track! ........ anyways I do FJ bloody panzer grens will pinch all the halftrack space

Yer damn right we would - 'tis a very big field!!!

[Peiper]

TBH ive found most of these comments laughable,
and most are from non-reenactors, basically we are
RE-ENACTORS, the battles scenarios will NOT be 100%
authentic, of course not as we are RE-ENACTORS, we are
acting a part, things such as hatches on tanks left open
etc that is all part of it, we are playing for the crowd ie= YOU.

This sort of thing has been discussed before, we cannot get
any more realistic unless we start using live ammunition,
we reenactors cannot win can we lol, we could make it more
realistic, we could stage hangings, shoot prisoners etc but
we have to limit our portrayal to something that is accepted.

Speaking for myself (who is a reenactor of 5yrs) i thought the show
was excellent considering that compared to the W&P or Oddysey
etc it was on a smaller scale plus many reenactor groups didnt attend
i reckon IMHO it couldn't have been done any better, well done to all
REENACTORS who attended and took part
Peiper

[Halle]

Nobody , including myself , is criticising the event organisers , OR the Pyro teams , OR the vehicle owners , I think we're all aware of how difficult it is to stage something like this , to put on a show AND do it safely - you only have to hear the applause at the end to realise people love it .

No , it's not real , it's a show , a mock up - but then we're not real soldiers , are we ? And still ( most of us ) strive to get our appearances right , the details correct , for ourselves , our fellow reenactors and the public .

So people having an opinion on how the "battle" may be improved is not any different in my opinion - you can't change who "dies " when , but you could change the overall format of the battle - most people I have spoken to say it was better on the Sunday than the Saturday , I agree , as a few things were changed , that's all - why not have the Axis attack for a change ?

Having said all that , once again , well done to all those involved in its production , including the reenactors , who also give their time , money and enthusiasm towards its success .

[BaggyPants]

why not have the Axis attack for a change ?

Because it wouldn't be a change. Did it two years ago

[carvillan]

@Peiper

I didn't say anything about the hatches, it was a comment made to me by one of the Stug (Heidi) drivers from Sturmpanzer. So to try to make out I made the comment being a non-re-enactor who obviously knows nothing is wrong.

And like I have said, the show was excellent and certainly has made me want to get involved some how with the portrayal of 1st SS LAH.

[Peiper]

@Peiper

I didn't say anything about the hatches, it was a comment made to me by one of the Stug (Heidi) drivers from Sturmpanzer. So to try to make out I made the comment being a non-re-enactor who obviously knows nothing is wrong.

And like I have said, the show was excellent and certainly has made me want to get involved some how with the portrayal of 1st SS LAH.

Nothing personal Cavallian i was using that quote as an example,
i was trying to emphasise the fact that whatever we did we could
not get the battle scenarios any better imho, i was aiming my post
at other NON reenactors who may be reading this, also i would like
to point out that the reenactors who attended this event did it for free,
no profit was made for reenactors at this and mostly all the other events,
(i for one have never earnt anything during the last five yrs), all equipment,
uniforms, vehicles, weapons are paid for by the reenactor infact we dont get
a penny for our efforts so i think we deserve some credit, this is directed to
those reading these posts who are unaware of the situation, basically we are all
volunteers to these shows which i think the general public who criticise or make
comments are unaware of the fact, also most of the profits of these shows are
usually given to veteran charities as far as iam aware.

These events i think benefit the public far more than the reenactor and i reckon
the public should be made more aware of this fact, this is not aimed at any individual
just a statement that imho should be said.
Regards Pipes