''Over the Top''?
-
- Posts: 505
- Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2007 1:04 pm
''Over the Top''?
Hallo,
The following is what someone said to me about personal items and kit used by Living Historians...
Now days there is a lot more available to Living Historians than there was to a German Soldier in say 1944...
Do us Living Historians go ''Over the Top'' stuffing our pockets with Personal Items and Kit?
I could stff my pockets BUT is it authentic? True, many pictures show that German Soldiers have pockets so full they can not stuff anymore in BUT what was in them? I think it probably would have been food...and not perfectly wraped and labled but just a crust of bread and apple or two (If you were lucky!)...Brobably a gas tablet container and LOTS of spare ammo (Not even in boxes)...
I don't think soldiers had loads of personal items! Maybe a wallet, K98 cleaning kit, possibely a Spork! But not all the items you see people going round with, Scho-Ka-Kola (Not seen by 1944, I know there are card and metal ones dated 1944 but they were not issued to every soldier!), Perfectly wrapped food, SKAT cards (I know it was common for soldiers to play cards BUT not every soldier would have a set) and Esbit cookers (Ask a vetran and he will probably say no, Watches, not common to have a watch like the NCO's BUT more like no watch or a pocket watch from you father!
What do you carry in your pockets, do you go over the top?
All the best,
Nathan
The following is what someone said to me about personal items and kit used by Living Historians...
Now days there is a lot more available to Living Historians than there was to a German Soldier in say 1944...
Do us Living Historians go ''Over the Top'' stuffing our pockets with Personal Items and Kit?
I could stff my pockets BUT is it authentic? True, many pictures show that German Soldiers have pockets so full they can not stuff anymore in BUT what was in them? I think it probably would have been food...and not perfectly wraped and labled but just a crust of bread and apple or two (If you were lucky!)...Brobably a gas tablet container and LOTS of spare ammo (Not even in boxes)...
I don't think soldiers had loads of personal items! Maybe a wallet, K98 cleaning kit, possibely a Spork! But not all the items you see people going round with, Scho-Ka-Kola (Not seen by 1944, I know there are card and metal ones dated 1944 but they were not issued to every soldier!), Perfectly wrapped food, SKAT cards (I know it was common for soldiers to play cards BUT not every soldier would have a set) and Esbit cookers (Ask a vetran and he will probably say no, Watches, not common to have a watch like the NCO's BUT more like no watch or a pocket watch from you father!
What do you carry in your pockets, do you go over the top?
All the best,
Nathan
-
- Posts: 1527
- Joined: Mon Feb 12, 2007 9:25 pm
Re: ''Over the Top''?
I am writing an article on this for my group as we speak. As soon as it's finished I'll translate it and post it.
Re: ''Over the Top''?
Gruss gottGR916/15/14 wrote:Hallo,
The following is what someone said to me about personal items and kit used by Living Historians...
Now days there is a lot more available to Living Historians than there was to a German Soldier in say 1944...
Do us Living Historians go ''Over the Top'' stuffing our pockets with Personal Items and Kit?
I could stff my pockets BUT is it authentic? True, many pictures show that German Soldiers have pockets so full they can not stuff anymore in BUT what was in them? I think it probably would have been food...and not perfectly wraped and labled but just a crust of bread and apple or two (If you were lucky!)...Brobably a gas tablet container and LOTS of spare ammo (Not even in boxes)...
I don't think soldiers had loads of personal items! Maybe a wallet, K98 cleaning kit, possibely a Spork! But not all the items you see people going round with, Scho-Ka-Kola (Not seen by 1944, I know there are card and metal ones dated 1944 but they were not issued to every soldier!), Perfectly wrapped food, SKAT cards (I know it was common for soldiers to play cards BUT not every soldier would have a set) and Esbit cookers (Ask a vetran and he will probably say no, Watches, not common to have a watch like the NCO's BUT more like no watch or a pocket watch from you father!
What do you carry in your pockets, do you go over the top?
All the best,
Nathan
What you say is true in most cases but most of the personal items were bought privately anyway
and weren't issued
Items such as Schokakola, chocolate, tobacco etc were purchased from military canteens to add to their
rations.
Other items such as washing kit ie= razors, blades, soap, comb etc, they too were bought by the soldier
as he had to supply these things himself, obviously the more well off/higher rank the items would be of
a better/luxury quality rather than just standard
As for items such as watches etc, these items were produced at a low cost apparantly, the state named a
fixed standard price and companies had to sell them for that, also items sold in military establishments
were at a reduced rate anyway.
For items such as playing cards and tobbacco, these were taxed, you can see on surviving examples the tax
label which was usually affixed.
For more information try reading the new "Deutche Soldaten" book which gives a list of some personal items.
Regards Pipes.
Last edited by Peiper on Fri Nov 26, 2010 1:24 pm, edited 2 times in total.
-
- Posts: 5732
- Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:41 pm
- Location: TAMPERE FINLAND
- Contact:
Re: ''Over the Top''?
Natian good sir he would have his Soldbuch and other paper work that he needs to carry out his dutys .Then we have to think what his job is and were is he in camp then just paper work or what he is orderd to .In the field then it is diffrent is he a smoker ? what he smokes and the big one what is his Job a Pionere will fill his pockets with diffrent things to a Medic I am not trying to tell you to suck eggs just to think what your doing
Scho-Ka-Kola that was still about till 1945 and issued in the book Black Edelwiss it states that the U.S prisoners were given a tin each this was during Nordwind
As for the watch most N.C.Os could be issued with a watch or any one with a trade that needed one .during WWII the most common watch would be a fob watch thats what the little pocket in the trousers is for
Scho-Ka-Kola that was still about till 1945 and issued in the book Black Edelwiss it states that the U.S prisoners were given a tin each this was during Nordwind
As for the watch most N.C.Os could be issued with a watch or any one with a trade that needed one .during WWII the most common watch would be a fob watch thats what the little pocket in the trousers is for
Re: ''Over the Top''?
In the book 'Feldbluse' there is a 1944 photo showing the contents of "a few" german soldiers' pockets, as emptied by a group of US soldiers.
It's incredible that amount of stuff they carried.
Compass, flashlight, can openers, shaving kit, pocket knife, whistle, keys, sewing kits, lighters, pens, paper, small maps, pipes and tobacco, egg, gun cleaning kit, notebook, matches, wound dressings, mirrors, candle, leather repair kit, and much more.
As opposed to reenactors, soldiers back then lived in their uniforms. All their scarce personal belongings had to be carried with them everywhere.
Most photos of reenactors show their pockets almost flat, and breadbag looking empty. This is not the same image you get when you look at photos of real frontline soldiers.
In my opinion most reenactors have too few items in their pockets. And a lot got the "wrong" items.
Most people stuff their pockets with the mainstray reproduction personal items, and therefore end up with a load of so-called issue items that everyone else also got. Just look at the number of the SOF sold repro wallet that people carry around (whihc is for veichles anyway). Why not go to an antique dealer and find a nice old wallet?
My pockets are quite filled out when i'm at field events; whistle, compass, notebook, pencils, toilet paper, small scarf, comb, small mirror, soldbuch, pocket knife, pocket watch and additional paperwork if needed.
My combat jacket bakc when I did my service, was even more full of odd stuff, and madatory junk.
It's all about living out of your uniform. Hardcore field events will teach this in no time.
It's incredible that amount of stuff they carried.
Compass, flashlight, can openers, shaving kit, pocket knife, whistle, keys, sewing kits, lighters, pens, paper, small maps, pipes and tobacco, egg, gun cleaning kit, notebook, matches, wound dressings, mirrors, candle, leather repair kit, and much more.
As opposed to reenactors, soldiers back then lived in their uniforms. All their scarce personal belongings had to be carried with them everywhere.
Most photos of reenactors show their pockets almost flat, and breadbag looking empty. This is not the same image you get when you look at photos of real frontline soldiers.
In my opinion most reenactors have too few items in their pockets. And a lot got the "wrong" items.
Most people stuff their pockets with the mainstray reproduction personal items, and therefore end up with a load of so-called issue items that everyone else also got. Just look at the number of the SOF sold repro wallet that people carry around (whihc is for veichles anyway). Why not go to an antique dealer and find a nice old wallet?
My pockets are quite filled out when i'm at field events; whistle, compass, notebook, pencils, toilet paper, small scarf, comb, small mirror, soldbuch, pocket knife, pocket watch and additional paperwork if needed.
My combat jacket bakc when I did my service, was even more full of odd stuff, and madatory junk.
It's all about living out of your uniform. Hardcore field events will teach this in no time.
Re: ''Over the Top''?
I was about to post the same. It is a good image that I have used to help populate my pockets. It is missing the letters and other papers that all soldiers carried.
I think your friend needs to look at the records and update his ideas.
I think your friend needs to look at the records and update his ideas.
-
- Posts: 5732
- Joined: Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:41 pm
- Location: TAMPERE FINLAND
- Contact:
Re: ''Over the Top''?
Yes Mikkel I agree with you My during my service time when in the field my smock Pockets were full .But like I was tring to say to Natian that your job would also dictate what you would have in your pockets
- Salacious Crumb
- Posts: 753
- Joined: Tue Aug 15, 2006 12:30 pm
- Location: Jabba's palace
- Contact:
Re: ''Over the Top''?
the westland funker I know thold me they had found honey in Russia and taken a barel of it! All incase times would be worse. He also told me they had several gasmaskcontainers filled with honey!
The NSKK vet I know thold me last week they got some slices of bread everyday and some cigarettes. He didn't smoke but his brother did, so he traded the cigarettes for the bread, becouse he was always hungry. He thold me also he traded in Russia his wristwatch for a bread! You must understand the food wasn't always delivered on time.
He also thold me a NSKK officer and some men went at night to a farm to demand(at gunpoint) a Russian farmer some potatoes. The squad inclusive the officer had to do minefield duty as punishement!
The NSKK vet I know thold me last week they got some slices of bread everyday and some cigarettes. He didn't smoke but his brother did, so he traded the cigarettes for the bread, becouse he was always hungry. He thold me also he traded in Russia his wristwatch for a bread! You must understand the food wasn't always delivered on time.
He also thold me a NSKK officer and some men went at night to a farm to demand(at gunpoint) a Russian farmer some potatoes. The squad inclusive the officer had to do minefield duty as punishement!
Re: ''Over the Top''?
Just a quick look through my pockets: matches, needle with a roll thread, spoon, pencil, small notebook, old map from a previous event, bar of chocolat, a panzergrenadier merkblatt, small wallet (with Kennkarte, documents, condom, photo's of friends, some Marks, spare buttons), scarf, toiletpaper, and some bands cut from a inner tube (the most usefull stuff for almost everything!).
Stuff I don't need at any time will be put in my breadbag. Next to that, before each event my pockets and breadbag will be filled with a lot of food. Basicly it contains everything that I would need when out in the field. The best way to learn how important it is to have your pockets and breadbag full of stuff is to do tacticals where you don't have the luxury at each moment. I don't think that you can get over the top easily, too much is better than having too little, when out in the fields.
Stuff I don't need at any time will be put in my breadbag. Next to that, before each event my pockets and breadbag will be filled with a lot of food. Basicly it contains everything that I would need when out in the field. The best way to learn how important it is to have your pockets and breadbag full of stuff is to do tacticals where you don't have the luxury at each moment. I don't think that you can get over the top easily, too much is better than having too little, when out in the fields.
Re: ''Over the Top''?
last time i had some stale bread and lump of chicken wrapped in brown paper, made a great looking lunch, for say 1944 time what should i carry? I am prepared to make items, from james
Re: ''Over the Top''?
See above for ideasjeep111 wrote:last time i had some stale bread and lump of chicken wrapped in brown paper, made a great looking lunch, for say 1944 time what should i carry? I am prepared to make items, from james
Personally in my pockets i carry a couple of bandages, a wallet containing Soldbuch, a few
Marks and period photographs and letters, a couple of rounds of deact ammo and some
tobacco or cigarettes in period wrappers/packets including period lighter or matches, any item
such as cigarettes etc must be in an authentic period packet or container.
Soldier of fortune is good for items such as this so give them a look
Regards P.
Re: ''Over the Top''?
cigs for a 15 year old well ive got a pipe and an old tabbaco (1942 dated) tin with tea leavs in it ,
Re: ''Over the Top''?
Here is a collection of some items from a friends impression.
Most is carried on him, or in his pack, during our field events.
Mine is somewhat the same, but I'm a non-smoker so he had more to show
Most is carried on him, or in his pack, during our field events.
Mine is somewhat the same, but I'm a non-smoker so he had more to show
- Attachments
-
- personal_equipment.jpg (226.01 KiB) Viewed 6242 times
Re: ''Over the Top''?
Hi Mikkel,
really nice impression!!! Your friend is doing a good job. Well done.
Best regards,
Caen44.
really nice impression!!! Your friend is doing a good job. Well done.
Best regards,
Caen44.
Re: ''Over the Top''?
i want a pipe , but i dont want to spend loads (its only for display) any suggestions where from.
heres some of my personal kit
heres some of my personal kit