This is not good news.

[Tychsen]

http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/ ... ost2691508
Post 43

wearing of military uniform is not allowed in France for civilians. All uniforms are banned, including french ones. Displaying any item bearing TR symbols or related to an organisation involved in war crimes and crimes against Humanity is also forbidden. And according to a new law in preparation, SELLING any item or garment of this kind won't be allowed very soon. For the people caught selling for instance a visor cap or a dagger, they'll loose their right to own sport or hunt pistols and rifles (if they are shooters or hunters of course), all weapons will be kept by authorities with no compensation. For the others collectors, huge fine in perspective...
Concerning the case of the ban of german uniforms in Normandy for the commemos, it is because there are more and more german reenactors each year, and not all of them are serious reenactors. Last year there was a group called "Vent D'europe" (wind of Europe), in which the members were neo-nazis. They didn't came for reenacting in fact, even if they were wearing german uniforms, it was more like a provocating propaganda parade. Some complained and you know the rest...Maybe some group of US reenacting are also a bit "bitter" seeing so many german reenactors for a commemo which is supposed to honor allied troops helping to liberate France...
this said, there is no need i think for german reenactors in french commemos.
If you want to reenact as a german, go to UK, USA or Spain, in countries that were not occupied and are logically less "fussy" about this particular subject.

This is not good news .

This law if it comes into force may well change the character of what we expect Normandy to be like.
Certainly it will kill stone dead the collectors fairs and related trade .
Some commonsense is required , this is plain stupid.

[Mikkel]

I thought France already had simmilar laws regarding 3R symbols, as Germany?

[Ted]

It Does....

[Gren Broich]

SO what next,book burnings of undesirable history books etc? What a brave new world we live in

[Tychsen]

The french will make their own laws as they deem fit - we will be but visitors , they may well be cumbersome and insane - I just thank God we won't have them.
The Normandy holiday trade will suffer , of course it is stupid , idiotic and is way OTT but it is only the french who can say "hold on lads - we elected you".

[Reich Crispies]

Interesting stuff.
A ban on ALL uniforms will surely be totally counter productive to future events. I do however think that, with the exception of designated displays and events, no one should be "wandering around" in uniforms be they German or allied. We dont do it here either.

How "official" is this? We already had one hint of this earlier, which as I recall, was soundly "Poo-Pahhed".

If you want to reenact as a german, go to UK, USA or Spain, in countries that were not occupied and are logically less "fussy" about this particular subject.

Good job the former Soviet union dosnt seem to mind

[TacAide]

....The Normandy holiday trade will suffer , of course it is stupid , idiotic and is way OTT but it is only the french who can say "hold on lads - we elected you".

This is perhaps the key issue here, money talks and when the locals see a reduction in the number of visitors to the D-Day sites, Chambers of Commerce may begin to reevaluate punative measures aimed at Axis reenactors. You can be certain word will spread that the Axis reenactment event at DMC attracted, according to the owner of the museum, the largest number of visitors he had witnessed, including the crowds for the 60th anniv. I understand they were all big spenders on both Axis reenactment gear and in the local cafes and pubs (such as they are in France).

In the historic towns and holiday sites, literally deserted by the French after 8pm, the only establishments doing business were those frequented by Axis reenactors in civvies! Decent meals and pint glasses, none of your wine glasses full of froth! The French (Ami) reenactors went home after 9pm. I noticed that Omaha Beach establishments, for example, closed down at 9:30pm on D-Day itself!

In every country local businesses and politicans have significant influence and the lure of jobs and cash flow from well-organised and fairly policed WW2 reenactment events may provoke a reassesment of laws, politically inspired and intended to lump the serious reenactor in with the political activists.

How you provoke that debate is another matter. You could start by the various Associations pointing out to the French, that Axis reenactment, properly controlled, IS good for business.

[Tychsen]

Reichs Crispies
How "official" is this? We already had one hint of this earlier, which as I recall, was soundly "Poo-Pahhed".

Time will tell , at first look it may seem to be what our deact. laws threatened before some slight common sense appeared.
On the otherhand we jsut don't know - its wait and see time .
I would be inclined to agree that if it does turn out to be bad for trade and tourism , it will be judged to be bad.
To enact a law which bans the militeria trade in german WW2 items sounds like utter insanity in itself - especially if it is tied to the withdrawl of firearms permits etc , that is plain stupid.

If these laws are being shaped , it is being done beyond tese shores and we can but wait and see what comes forth.

[Gren Broich]

Yes,lets hope the people of Normandy kick-up.Hope this is not one of those things that ends up being taken up by the whole E.U. as has happened before.

[missyd]

If you want to reenact as a german, go to UK, USA or Spain, in countries that were not occupied and are logically less "fussy" about this particular subject.

I suggest Italy .... never heard of any problems wearing German uniforms there ....
If you want to go for axis force in a country where german uniforms are forbidden .... go for the Italian RSI .... in Switzerland we can't wear german uniforms on events (not forbidden by law but by the organizer) but they allow all kind of italian uniforms! R.E., Decima Mas, GNR, MVSN, Birgate Nero ....

[SchnellMeyer]

Well we were in Normandy this year again and were well aware of the Laws .We had no trouble with the Police but we did see a increase in Police presents around certain sites .Of course we did not give the Police any reasons to bother us either , we covered up all our insignia on our Kubel's , BMW's ,Zundapp's and Truck .
I do think that the French are over reacting as only the Frogs do but we will have to wait and see .
TacAide I think you have the right idea , when the French see the revenue drop from D-Day they soon will wake up .This is another reason why I think the owner of the Dead Man's Corner Museum supported the Fallschirmjaeger event this year , he is looking ahead , when all the vets are done the only other option is the reenactors .
As well as Italy , Hungary is another country that you will have no trouble in ( well unless you act the total fool ) .We plan to attend a large event there next year .This event is already being prepared and 100's of reenactors will be there .
The Frogs loss will be somebody elses gain .

[Steinmetz]

Think you hit the nail on the head, SchnellMeyer. Money talks, and it won't be long before they feel it in the pocket.

Cheers
Geordie

[Pete Skillman]

Hi Guys,
I think this actually comes from higher up, I was at small town in Belgium called Boom....(Yes I know, good name for a battle... ) over 5 years ago and I was talking to the organiser of the event, I was with the Hampshire's reenactment group and we were to support some Sherman tanks entering the town reenacting what had happened relieving the town etc.. Lee Attwells Pioneers were the Axis..
The organiser said that the EU were to start removing support for such events in the aim of getting the EU public to forget/ not commemorate the events of 39/45...to garnish a better Europe!!..I as an Englishman obviously put this down as a mere Johnny foreigner ranting fantasy!!
BUT...a couple years later I was in Nijmegan,Holland at an event where again the organisers said that places like Arnhem and Nijmegen ,Holland and Normandy were to start to suffer the EU withdrawing financial support for other non ww2 events in the area if they carry on having WW2 celebrations!!. and were to start having problems getting permission and finance to support such events..
I agree that the French do have their own ways in obeying EU but if this is the underhand way of doing things and I have seen it in action in UK where anything the EU hel[ps financially you have to let people know and have posters/pamphlets saying EU paid etc...
So maybe this is BIG BROTHER EU style..??
Yours Faithfully,
Pete

[Pete Skillman]

AND.......................................
Sorry, too much wine!.
I was at the inception of the 2nd armored group '93/'94 , (Jonny Heyworth) and the laws about this has also been tightened right up to the point now that the French cannot privately own any armored vehicles and anyone (2nd Arm) wanting to visit their country has to go thru all sorts of hoops and rings to get permission to do something like a commemorative route drive.
This is blamed on Muslim terrorists etc... but 25 yrs of IRA activity on mainland Europe did not bring anything like the pathetic laws we have now?! .
God knows how places like Arromanches,St Mere,Bastogne .........Waterloo (Different enemy) will survive.
Pete

[SchnellMeyer]

Hopefully in time the French will see sence but there is also I think a underline feeling that they are afraid that these events may bring the " wrong type of people" to their country .I do not blame them for this but yet again this is a typical example of how Governments punish all for the wrong doings of a few .
Sadly Gentlemen we are doing a hobby that leaves us at the mercy of most Law makers.
There is EU law there when it comes to "Nazi" badges and insignia , to date alot of EU countries do not fully enforce it but this may change in time .
Pete , it is not 100% true that you cannot own armour in France .The French have just made the laws harder for vehicle owners , now you also need special permits to move armour vehicles around France which you must get from the Police.
This yet again is another example of how Governments have got it wrong , would you rob a bank wth a K98 or a Uzi ? There within lies the answers Kamerads.