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 Post subject: SS troops in full camo
PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2014 9:34 pm 
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I have been noticing something... "odd"... the last while, and I am not sure whether it is my imagination, or whether a new source on SS uniforms has been uncovered recently.

Looking at photos from re-enactments, specifically ones where SS troops are present, I cannot help but notice the following:
- Dot44 trousers
- Dot44 tunic
- camo helmet cover, winter/autumn pattern

...and these guys end up looking more like modern Bundswehr soldiers on a Tropentarn exercise than anything else.

So, my question: how common was it for SS soldiers to go into combat with all three of those camo items present and worn? What is the historic precedent? Did it happen frequently, or is it our modern fascination with camo that is bleeding back into history via the Farb Element?

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:26 am 
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Location: Philippines, south east asia
A look at photos of late war SS troops will show that this was reasonably common. Of course the helmet covers will never match the uniforms as those would not be in dot 44 pattern. Of course other combinations did occur and were equally common...smocks with dot 44 pants, Dot 44 jackets with field grey pants (somewhat less common), and even dot 44 pants with field grey uppers. Less common but evident in some european volunteer units. I once did a survey of all the possible combinations in my reference library and came up with a bewildering count of possible combinations, including quite a few examples of jackboots worn with dot 44's. I will try to look for the list i made and re-post.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 3:29 am 
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Location: Philippines, south east asia
Here you go:

OK, so having read all the comments on the use of Pea/Dot/Erbsenmuster 43/44 I decided to do a completely unscientific survey of all the Dot 44 photos i could find, to see if we can see some sort of trend. the books consulted were the following:

Osprey Warrior series 2 - waffen SS
Osprey Elite: Peiper and Skorzeny
Verweht sind die Spuren (history of the 5SS Pz Div, Wiking)
Beaver and Borsallero's Camouflage uniforms of the waffen SS
Concord - waffen SS in action, waffen SS in combat, waffen SS from glory to defeat and German armoured units in Arnhem
and Craig luther's Blood and Honor; history of the 12th SS Pz Div.

I totalled my observations but did not make entries where it was impossible to make a clear determination. Some photos were cropped, the ones where collar ranks from the feldgrau tunic underneath did not show but were sufficiently "puffed up" to indicate a jacket was worn under were counted as such. On the other hand, those that seemed loose or obviously only had the undershirt showing were also listed as such. So here goes:

TOTAL uniforms - 62
--------------------------------------------------------------

Eastern front - 28
Western front - 25
--------------------------------------------------------------

Worn over wool - 18
Worn without wool - 17
--------------------------------------------------------------

worn with smock - 6
complete suit - 20
combo with feldgrau (tunic or pants) - 27
combo with italian pants - 1

--------------------------------------------------------------

worn with low boots - 29
worn with jackboots - 9

Read what you will from this list. My conclusion is that with dot 44 pretty much anything goes.

But the more important conclusion is that i am an idiot with nothing better to do.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 7:15 am 
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askhati wrote:
I have been noticing something... "odd"... the last while, and I am not sure whether it is my imagination, or whether a new source on SS uniforms has been uncovered recently.

Looking at photos from re-enactments, specifically ones where SS troops are present, I cannot help but notice the following:
- Dot44 trousers
- Dot44 tunic
- camo helmet cover, winter/autumn pattern

...and these guys end up looking more like modern Bundswehr soldiers on a Tropentarn exercise than anything else.

So, my question: how common was it for SS soldiers to go into combat with all three of those camo items present and worn? What is the historic precedent? Did it happen frequently, or is it our modern fascination with camo that is bleeding back into history via the Farb Element?


Just go to google and type 'waffen ss normandy', then click images and you'll see just how common it was.

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 30, 2014 7:16 am 
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Even panzer crews wore them.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 9:33 am 
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I am not even going to get involved in this nonsense that has been done to death over the years. My comment is simply this - IF you are genuinely interested in this subject, or any WW2 related subject for that matter, why not do some research for yourself before posting anything on here.

The sources of available material have never been more plentiful or accessible, though not everything can simply be achieved by a couple of clicks on google. Instead of coming straight on here and making half cocked statements, framed as questions or not, try learning something for yourself.

There are folks on this forum that could tell you which company of which battalion of which regiment within a given division were issued with a particular pattern of SS camouflage smock at particular time during a specific campaign - how can they do this? Because they have studied and painstakingly researched their interest over years.

If your genuinely interested you could try a bit of research for yourself or you could just sit at you PC and throw out a few random lines on a forum......

Reenactors frequently get things wrong but arm yourself with knowledge before you attempt to spark a debate about which you obviously have little understanding. Otherwise all you will achieve is a bunch of responses all of which may be inaccurate - how will you judge if you have no benchmark?


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 9:54 am 
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Location: South Africa
I was just honestly puzzled by the (apparent) rise of Dot44's popularity. From when I started out, I have a clear recollection of veteran re-enactors warning me to stay away from this modern obsession with full-camo impressions, and to rather do proper research on the unit being displayed, and whether their logistics did, in fact, involve a plentiful supply of camo. This is in exact concordance with your statement on research.

So.. the one lot tells you to avoid it and rather do research; the other lot tells you to do research and use it. Interesting :P

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 10:56 am 
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Check out this farb. Pah - plane tree cover only


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 12:27 pm 
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And his trousers and tunic don't even match .... :wink: :lol: :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 12:43 pm 
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Jesus - farbtastic!

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 12:55 pm 
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I did this impression a couple of years back when I was a Krankenträger in our group. I didn't really put much research in the impression as to which unit would have worn this combo. Thought it looked neat, and yeah I look a bit retarded due to a nasty cold :p



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 11:15 pm 
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Location: West Virginia USA
I have two books about the Waffen-SS Panzer divisions. One is Steel Storm: Waffen-SS Panzer Battles on the Eastern Front 1943-1945. The other is Steel Rain: Waffen-SS Panzer battles in the West 1944-1945. In both of these books, done by the same author, there are multiple different photographs of German troops in M44 'Pea Dot' camo tunics and trousers, with jack boots and ankle boots with gaiters, mostly stahlhelms from what I saw.

It was used quite often. I LOVE my Pea Dot tunic and my heavy AGM MP40. :wink:

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