Bergmutze questions ?
Moderator: Feldjager
Bergmutze questions ?
Was production of the Bergmutze carried on after the introduction of 43 style hats. ?
Did Jager Divisions carry on use of the Bergmutze after designation changes ?
How much use was made of the lufwaffe Blue bergmutze ?
cloth / metal edelweis - which was early / late / preffered / more common in certain units etc ?
Did Jager Divisions carry on use of the Bergmutze after designation changes ?
How much use was made of the lufwaffe Blue bergmutze ?
cloth / metal edelweis - which was early / late / preffered / more common in certain units etc ?
Gliderinf / Luftlande
Re: Bergmutze questions ?
Surely on smaller scale. In fact, all units originally 'mountain' in their character (1-3 and 5 div) retained bergies until the very end beside increasing number M43s. Bergmutze was just the part of their 'esprit de corps'.Gliderinf wrote:Was production of the Bergmutze carried on after the introduction of 43 style hats.?
Never heard of any of them. Why ? There were no LW mountain units. You probably mean M43 caps.Gliderinf wrote:How much use was made of the lufwaffe Blue bergmutze ?
Cap insignia: metal edelweiss was Heer GJ thing, while cloth patch was of SS GJ units. Sometimes metal edelweisses were adopted on smaller scale by SS (esp. officers).Gliderinf wrote:cloth / metal edelweis - which was early / late / preffered / more common in certain units etc ?
Arm insignia: both Heer and SS used cloth ones, but of different 'edelweiss' motive.
Es steht ein kleines, kleines Edelweiß
auf einer steilen, steilen Felsenhöh!
Kampfgruppe EDELWEIß
1 KP, 100 GJR
auf einer steilen, steilen Felsenhöh!
Kampfgruppe EDELWEIß
1 KP, 100 GJR
Re: Bergmutze questions ?
Aye-up marrio. supposedly there was a luftwaffe blue Bergmutze Available ( well acording to the SOLDAT falshie book ) but it does not give much info on how much issue / use of these was made
Gliderinf / Luftlande
Re: Bergmutze questions ?
I'm getting the Jager bit the wrong way around -
Jager divisions generally formed from Light Divisions / Infantry Divisions = Did they have Bergmutze ?
Plus were there any Jager titled units at the start of the war ? (with Bergmutze ?)
Jager divisions generally formed from Light Divisions / Infantry Divisions = Did they have Bergmutze ?
Plus were there any Jager titled units at the start of the war ? (with Bergmutze ?)
Gliderinf / Luftlande
- Crazy Feldgendarme
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Re: Bergmutze questions ?
Gents i draw your attention to Uniforms and Insignia of the Lufftwaffe
Volume 1 1935-1940
Brian L Davies
Arms and Armour press
ISBN 1-85409-497-1
Page 210
the Luftwaffe version of the Mountain Cap was part of the special clothing issued to personnel of Flak and Air Signals units operating in mountainous terrain (see also page 225). of Luftwaffe blue-grey material. It was closely modelled on the pattern of the ARMY mountain cap. On the front of the cap was the Luftwaffe version of the national emblem in Aluminium metal below which was the Reichscockade. The curtains of the cap were fastened at the front by two 0.12 cm-diameter blue-grey finished buttons.
In 1941 Luftwaffe units operating in Norway recieved supplies of the Mountain cap and in 1943 instructions were issued with regards to its waer by Officers and armed forces officials with officer rank.
Luftwaffe-Verordnungsblatt Nr. 39. part C, dated 3 October page 1938 271. Order Nr 838 issued 22 September 1938.
Luftwaffe-Verordnungsblatt Nr. 41. part C, dated 11 September 1939 page 323. Order Nr 547 issued 17 June 1938.
And a photo on Page 225 that clearly shows the Bergmutz with Eidelweiss.
Volume 1 1935-1940
Brian L Davies
Arms and Armour press
ISBN 1-85409-497-1
Page 210
the Luftwaffe version of the Mountain Cap was part of the special clothing issued to personnel of Flak and Air Signals units operating in mountainous terrain (see also page 225). of Luftwaffe blue-grey material. It was closely modelled on the pattern of the ARMY mountain cap. On the front of the cap was the Luftwaffe version of the national emblem in Aluminium metal below which was the Reichscockade. The curtains of the cap were fastened at the front by two 0.12 cm-diameter blue-grey finished buttons.
In 1941 Luftwaffe units operating in Norway recieved supplies of the Mountain cap and in 1943 instructions were issued with regards to its waer by Officers and armed forces officials with officer rank.
Luftwaffe-Verordnungsblatt Nr. 39. part C, dated 3 October page 1938 271. Order Nr 838 issued 22 September 1938.
Luftwaffe-Verordnungsblatt Nr. 41. part C, dated 11 September 1939 page 323. Order Nr 547 issued 17 June 1938.
And a photo on Page 225 that clearly shows the Bergmutz with Eidelweiss.
May the fleas of a thousand camels infest the crotch of the person who screws up your day and may their arms be too short to scratch.
GeFoPo
GeFoPo
Re: Bergmutze questions ?
thanks Crazy - good stuff.
Anyone know more about Jager Issue ?
Anyone know more about Jager Issue ?
Gliderinf / Luftlande
Re: Bergmutze questions ?
Still after info on weather the Jager Divisions wore the Bergmutze through the war - or only early etc ?
Also - was the Jager Hat and sleeve insignia kept up to the end of the war ?
Also - was the Jager Hat and sleeve insignia kept up to the end of the war ?
Gliderinf / Luftlande
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Re: Bergmutze questions ?
Sorry was ment to get back to you I will dig the info out againGliderinf wrote:Still after info on weather the Jager Divisions wore the Bergmutze through the war - or only early etc ?
Also - was the Jager Hat and sleeve insignia kept up to the end of the war ?
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Re: Bergmutze questions ?
The Bergmütze was used by Gebrigsjäger Ski Jäger and Jäger troops also the fact that the Jäger Troops were Issued on 2 nd August 1942 Jäger cap badge it was not till 1944 that the Ski Jäger cap badge was Issued 21 st August 1944
As for the Jäger Arm badge it was introduced on thr 2nd October 1942
The arm badge was to be worn on the right upper arm 16cm from the shoulder seam on the tunic, and greatcoat
The stem of the of the oakleaf sprig was to be set at an angle of 45 deg to te lower edge of the cap and positioned with the tip of the sem 2.5 cm above the lower edge of the cap and 2 cm from the back of the cap peak
As for the Jäger Arm badge it was introduced on thr 2nd October 1942
The arm badge was to be worn on the right upper arm 16cm from the shoulder seam on the tunic, and greatcoat
The stem of the of the oakleaf sprig was to be set at an angle of 45 deg to te lower edge of the cap and positioned with the tip of the sem 2.5 cm above the lower edge of the cap and 2 cm from the back of the cap peak
Re: Bergmutze questions ?
Interesting - So early in the war - when they were Jager Regiments within Light Divisions - they would not be wearing the hat or sleeve patches - but later when the Divisions took on the Jager title - they then started to wear them.
So would they have the Bergmutze early on ? or just later with the Hat devices ?
on the hat devices - embroidered or Metal - whats more common / earlier / later etc ??
Do we know if there are any books on Jager units ?
Thanks Franz -
So would they have the Bergmutze early on ? or just later with the Hat devices ?
on the hat devices - embroidered or Metal - whats more common / earlier / later etc ??
Do we know if there are any books on Jager units ?
Thanks Franz -
Gliderinf / Luftlande
Re: Bergmutze questions ?
is it true that the Austrians has a special felt backing to their edelweiss? Not sure sometimes what is myth or not!
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Re: Bergmutze questions ?
My dear Gliderinf umm this is Heer stuff so a bit out of my field (SS ,Gebrigs) From the books that I can find a ref yes the Bergmutze was used early war for Jäger as for the cap badge I have seen only Metal ones
I will look out some info if I can
I will look out some info if I can
Re: Bergmutze questions ?
No problem mate - Dont expect you to know everything. All info greatfully recieved
Gliderinf / Luftlande
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Re: Bergmutze questions ?
I did find a ref to the fact that Austrian Jäger units did back the oak leaf cap badge with the arm of service colour (Unofficial )Alex wrote:is it true that the Austrians has a special felt backing to their edelweiss? Not sure sometimes what is myth or not!